Brake Flush

[Paladin611]

Greetings All,

So, here I am at the dealership to have the Stinger serviced. My odometer is less than a couple hundred miles from 45k. I asked the host, before taking the car, to ensure that the mechanic was adhering to the Normal Scheduled Maintenance parameters, plus to check the spark plugs, which Kia peculiarly suggests to replace at 42k.

The girl came back to the waiting room to confirm that everything checks out, but the the mechanic recommends a brake flush. I had planned to do this next Spring, along with a engine coolant flush, and carbon build-up flush. Have any of you had to have your brakes flushed at 45k miles, or relative? I gave them the approval to do it, as I’d imagine the mechanic saw something that prompted the need, though I can’t shake the feeling that they’re deliberately adding extra cost to my service today.

Regards.

 

[MerlintheMad]

I have not had a thing done to my brake system: still have c. 8mm of pad left and perfect operation. I did the recommended sparkplugs change and "discovered" a cracked number six cylinder plug. The saga lasted c. six months, so, even a simple sparkplugs change can result in issues. I know that if my service guy said "do a brake flush" I would not argue and just do it. On what basis would I argue? I've been trusting them with my car's maintenance from day one. In c. 3K miles I reach 60K miles and so my next oil change will include a bunch of stuff: probably run me into the $700 range: will I question what they say is necessary/recommended? No, because Kia has set up a schedule for those things, and I reckon that the warranty depends on keeping up with them. Something like flushing the brakes has to be more of a conditional decision than a so many miles thing.

 

[bfglitch]

Personally, anything any shop "recommends" something be replaced, swapped, flushed, etc outside of the normal schedule, I usually ask if I can speak to the tech or at least get a reason for their recommendation. Technically you can even ask for a side by side sample of your fluid to fresh fluid. Not sure how you drive your car but even within 45k miles if you're pretty hard on the brakes fairly often it's possible your fluid could use a changing. Can even be less than 45k. It all depends on how hard that fluid has had to work and how hot it has gotten.

 

[JSolo]

As a 2018 MY vehicle, the brakes should have been flushed twice now. Every 2 (3?) years. It's a time based service not mileage. Brake fluid absorbs moisture. This can lead to internal corrosion and/or brake fade if the fluid reaches boiling point under hard braking.

I do see where the owner's manual says every 4 years. Personally, 2-3 is my comfort level. I do it myself, so it costs me a bit of time and a few bottles of brake fluid. I use a motive power bleeder.

 

[D.J.]

along with a engine coolant flush,

Wouldn't that still be extremely early for a coolant change?

Isn't the first coolant change per the schedule after 200k kms (120k miles)?

 

[Rodtheviking]

I just did my coolant (replaced upper radiator hoses) and brake fluid (all new pads, rotors and stainless lines) at 20k, they both look like they needed it.

 

[JSolo]

^^Which fluid you go with?

Im ok with doing the radiator coolant, but it will be interesting to do the turbo intercooler - on the 2.5's it's liquid cooled.

 

[Ohiocruiser]

I flush the brakes once a year.

 

[Rodtheviking]

Zerex Green Asian fluid and Bosch ESI6 brake fluid

 

[ht_addict]

Follow the manual service intervals, not what your steallership recommends. It's a money grab. You only have to do what the manual says to maintain warranty.

The other thing is this Extreme/Normal Driving Conditions to determine intervals. Has anyone ever saw the or heard what exactly defined extreme. I live in Ontario, and at most of you add it up we may get 2-3mths if we are luck of extreme temperatures. Yet these cars are built tested to work in extreme conditions.

 

[D.J.]

The other thing is this Extreme/Normal Driving Conditions to determine intervals. Has anyone ever saw the or heard what exactly defined extreme.

Severe duty is... Just about everything..

 

[MerlintheMad]

The other thing is this Extreme/Normal Driving Conditions to determine intervals.

The 6K miles service interval reduced to 3K miles for severe driving conditions was modified to 4K miles by my dealership, because as you say most of the year there is no severity going on (no more salt on the roads). I upped my interval back to 6K miles when Kia started putting full synthetic oil in, at the beginning of this year: there is no way that full synthetic can be compromised in 6K miles through normal use.

 

[GT Elite]

I’m in Ontario and change the brake fluid every two years, as has already been noted, brake fluid absorbs water and that can be corrosive. Also, under some severe braking conditions brake fade is possible due to a lower boiling point for the brake fluid.

For the engine coolant, I like to change it every 5 years so. My shop (not a dealer) tests it for acidity and changes based on that.

 

[Paladin611]

^^Which fluid you go with?

Im ok with doing the radiator coolant, but it will be interesting to do the turbo intercooler - on the 2.5's it's liquid cooled.

I went with the brake flush.

 

[Paladin611]

I have not had a thing done to my brake system: still have c. 8mm of pad left and perfect operation. I did the recommended sparkplugs change and "discovered" a cracked number six cylinder plug. The saga lasted c. six months, so, even a simple sparkplugs change can result in issues. I know that if my service guy said "do a brake flush" I would not argue and just do it. On what basis would I argue? I've been trusting them with my car's maintenance from day one. In c. 3K miles I reach 60K miles and so my next oil change will include a bunch of stuff: probably run me into the $700 range: will I question what they say is necessary/recommended? No, because Kia has set up a schedule for those things, and I reckon that the warranty depends on keeping up with them. Something like flushing the brakes has to be more of a conditional decision than a so many miles thing.

That’s why I went with the decision to do it. I asked if the tech was basing the flush on the condition of the fluid, not just on mileage. The serviceperson affirmed that he had. I’m not one to refuse a service on my car, if it’s warranted. Even if one might be able to get away with not doing the flush until the next maintenance, one has to consider that we have a premium braking system on our cars, and probably best to ensure that it holds up well. That’s what went through my mind at the time. Brembo’s can be pretty pricey to replace.

 

[JSolo]

Now, did they do a proper flush or just put new fluid in the reservoir......... Sadly i've seen the latter done. Customer none the wiser unless they actually supervised it being done.

Even with a power bleeder (one man bleeder - pressure or vacuum), the process still takes at least 20-30 min to complete.

 

[stoopid]

I just did my coolant (replaced upper radiator hoses) and brake fluid (all new pads, rotors and stainless lines) at 20k, they both look like they needed it.

With a ~4 year old car, your mileage wasn't the determining factor (maybe that was your point of mentioning it?).

IMHO brake fluid (as well as transmission, differential, and coolant) interval changes are a money grab. Especially with dealers, who I've watched in my lifetime use their position of supplying warranty coverage as leverage to 'convince' (blackmail) customers into premature services. Yes, the fluid degrades but in a closed loop system it's difficult, even with temp swings, for moisture to build. It does, over time, but how quickly is certainly a point of contention. I can't envision a situation where anyone daily driving their car needs the brake fluid changed at 45k miles. Maybe in 4, 5, or 6 years? But not solely based on the mileage. These fluids are designed to a specification that takes into account people actually using their cars.

As with many service items for cars, like engine oil, there's extremes to which owners will go to protect their investment. Very little of it is grounded in reality of scientifically derived study. Dealers/service providers further perpetuate the paranoia because it benefits their bottom line. Manufacturers have a stake in the dealer / service model, their own maintenance intervals are often suspect and/or derived from no broader study of the things they're seemingly arbitrarily requiring, nor are the requirements independently verified. There is no objectivity, or accountability to the facts they proport, baked into this system of "do as we say". That's why I only do the baseline maintenance on the car, figuring there's a lot of profit and CYA inherent in the imposed intervals. Doing the bare minimum or even less than bare minimum is very likely still well ahead of the margin of error.

 

[Rodtheviking]

With a ~4 year old car, your mileage wasn't the determining factor (maybe that was your point of mentioning it?).

IMHO brake fluid (as well as transmission, differential, and coolant) interval changes are a money grab. Especially with dealers, who I've watched in my lifetime use their position of supplying warranty coverage as leverage to 'convince' (blackmail) customers into premature services. Yes, the fluid degrades but in a closed loop system it's difficult, even with temp swings, for moisture to build. It does, over time, but how quickly is certainly a point of contention. I can't envision a situation where anyone daily driving their car needs the brake fluid changed at 45k miles. Maybe in 4, 5, or 6 years? But not solely based on the mileage. These fluids are designed to a specification that takes into account people actually using their cars.

As with many service items for cars, like engine oil, there's extremes to which owners will go to protect their investment. Very little of it is grounded in reality of scientifically derived study. Dealers/service providers further perpetuate the paranoia because it benefits their bottom line. Manufacturers have a stake in the dealer / service model, their own maintenance intervals are often suspect and/or derived from no broader study of the things they're seemingly arbitrarily requiring, nor are the requirements independently verified. There is no objectivity, or accountability to the facts they proport, baked into this system of "do as we say". That's why I only do the baseline maintenance on the car, figuring there's a lot of profit and CYA inherent in the imposed intervals. Doing the bare minimum or even less than bare minimum is very likely still well ahead of the margin of error.

Correct, millage had no factor in it. I just happen to have the systems open for repair(torn upper hose) and an upgrade so might as well do a flush on both. Both the fluids looked like they were going to be in need a flush in the near future. The brake fluid was a little dark and cloudy at all four corners and the coolant was really low from a leak that I have no idea how long it had been there (used car). Glad I did both for my peace of mind, which is worth it to me no matter if its "required" service or not.

 

[ht_addict]

With a ~4 year old car, your mileage wasn't the determining factor (maybe that was your point of mentioning it?).

IMHO brake fluid (as well as transmission, differential, and coolant) interval changes are a money grab. Especially with dealers, who I've watched in my lifetime use their position of supplying warranty coverage as leverage to 'convince' (blackmail) customers into premature services. Yes, the fluid degrades but in a closed loop system it's difficult, even with temp swings, for moisture to build. It does, over time, but how quickly is certainly a point of contention. I can't envision a situation where anyone daily driving their car needs the brake fluid changed at 45k miles. Maybe in 4, 5, or 6 years? But not solely based on the mileage. These fluids are designed to a specification that takes into account people actually using their cars.

As with many service items for cars, like engine oil, there's extremes to which owners will go to protect their investment. Very little of it is grounded in reality of scientifically derived study. Dealers/service providers further perpetuate the paranoia because it benefits their bottom line. Manufacturers have a stake in the dealer / service model, their own maintenance intervals are often suspect and/or derived from no broader study of the things they're seemingly arbitrarily requiring, nor are the requirements independently verified. There is no objectivity, or accountability to the facts they proport, baked into this system of "do as we say". That's why I only do the baseline maintenance on the car, figuring there's a lot of profit and CYA inherent in the imposed intervals. Doing the bare minimum or even less than bare minimum is very likely still well ahead of the margin of error.

Unless some one is tracking there case daily, in sure brake fluid is good for the time we own our cars. Highly doubt we are hitting the Wet and Dry boiling point of brake fluid to cause any concern. And water, like to said unless you have a leak, should be a nice issue.

I've always been a follow the manual. When to here a "We Recommend this", you need to be quick and ask if there is a problem. If not then don't. My last car a Kia Optima Hybrid, I remember them "Recommending" services that were not due yet in the manual for either distance or years. One of them was my spark plugs. They wanted to replace almost 70000km before what the manual said. I pointed it out and the service guy said "you'll be lucky if they come out at that time". No issues coming out and certainly no issues with driving over that 70000km distance.

Honestly, until stuff brakes, or actually needs replaced, there's nothing to the service of a car, so dealerships have to come up with ways to pinch those pennies out of your pocket.

 

[7Andrei7]

What interval do your manuals recommend the brake fluid change? I'm asking because the european one recommends brake fluid change every 30k km / 20k miles.